a little 3-4 info

[feardaram]

im not good at this game, but i seem to run a relatively solid 3-4 defense, and figured i could share some insight. what i have to offer isnt fool-proof, or earth-shattering, but it works for me and i think it can work for you.

1. personell for the 3-4

the first thing you would want would be atleast 3, but preferably 4 good LBs (san diego, bengals, steelers, bears, etc). i run a 3-4 regardless of what team im using (with the dolphins all the time, who have 1 maybe 2 solid LBs), but that would be ideal. a big fat DT to clog the middle would be perfect. at DE, i would either want REALLY fast ends, or really strong ends. for the most part, your DEs wont be the ones creating pressure on the QB (unless they are really fast), so it would be nice if they could hold up the person trying to block them, or even push the blocker into the backfield. either works fine, but really fast DEs give you more flexability. safties who can tackle, and with some speed, are an asset. most of this seems self-explanatory, but i figured id mention it anyway.

2. my set up

my base set up, from every 3-4 formation (normal, over, under, solid), when the run is a threat, is to spread the Dline (L1 + up on the Dpad), loop the Dline (L1 + up on the right analog stick), and pinch the LBs (R1 + down on the Dpad). no matter what play i call, when the run is a threat, i set my defese up like this. doing this seems to hide the LBs a little better, allowing them to either shoot gaps blowing up the run, or simply just clogging the hell out of the middle, leaving the RB no room to run. tackling with the saftey is a must on alot of plays, as this set up will usually allow you to run free and make plays. against passing downs (2nd and long, or 3rd and not short), i usually just spread and loop my line, but i wont pinch. by not shifting my line, it isnt obvious where the pressure is going to come from. more than anything else i can tell you, i think this setup is the most important. most guys say they have a problem stopping the run from the 3-4, overall i dont with this setup. i will conceede that the 3-4 defense is not going to be very successful trying to stop 3rd and inches type plays. the 3-4 D will give up yards on the run, you just hope its 2 here, 3 there, etc.

3. the formations (normal, under, over, solid)

i use all of them. normal has the most amount of plays in it, but all are nice, and if just going by stock plays, all have some different ones. i use the 3-4 book.

anyway, the only real formation i use for a specific purpose is the 3-4 under. this is my stretch run killer (from strong i, or i normal). pick 2 man under (and do my normal setup of spread/loop line, pinch LBs), bump each WR, move the SS a little to the right of your screen (a little outside the TE), and control the FS. this setup will either allow the MLB to shoot the gap and crush the RB in the backfield or shoot the gap and force the RB outside way too fast. and almost everytime, the FS you are controlling will go unblocked, allowing you to run to the right of your screen to make the tackle for a short gain or even a loss. i used to get killed by guys who made a living off this run play, cuz using 3-4 normal gets the FS you are controlling blocked, instead of freeing him up. once i figured this out, i was able to hold guys in check who abused and overused this play.

4. my philosophy

blitz atleast 1 LB on most plays, try to mix things up, and bend but dont break. ill take small chances to get sacks, but i usually set up coverage behind it to avoid giving up huge chunks of yards. it sounds basic, but it works.

5. playing man D

when playing man D, i like to choose the double X/Z/TE plays as my base D. these have an OLB blitzing (i know the 3-4 normal has one where the OLB is on a delayed blitz, thats cool), one saftey in a deep zone, and the other doubling a WR or TE. what i tend to do when using these plays is to shift the coverage of the saftey already in a deep zone over to his side. so if the FS is in a deep zone in the middle of the field, ill press triangle + left on the R analog stick, to shift his coverage onto his side of the field. then ill take the SS, who is doubling the WR or TE, and put him in a deep zone. **NOTE** you HAVE to control the saftey you put into the deep zone. he will not cover the deep ball very well if you dont. its like he lets the WR run right by, even though he shows he is in a deep zone. let the CPU control the saftey you shifted over, and you control the one you put into a deep zone. just so your opponent cant key on your blitz side based on who you control, leave the saftey doubling the WR every now and then (be sure to freeze the D when coming out of the huddle, so the saftey doesnt run over there, or click on him real quick, move him a step, then click off). i just keep switching blitz sides. alot of the time, if the offense doesnt have RB blocking to that side, or a TE blocking on that side, the blitzing LB gets to the QB fairly quickly. i dont claim that this will create insane heat, but its usually enough to force throws, and you still have great coverage over top.

playing 3-4 2 man under: this has MLB #2 in a hook zone. you can either blitz him, use him to double someone, or put him into a zone where the offense keeps throwing. i like to flip the play, and put him into a purple zone, to keep the TE corner routes on lock.

other man blitzing plays i love: OLB dogs fire (both OLBs blitzing), MLB crossfire and storm blitz (both MLBs blitzing), trio whip man (ILB and OLB of the same side blitzing around the outside), and strong and weak blitz (ILB blitzing middle, OLB blitzing outside). all of these are cover 1 blitzes. to protect yourself deep, and to still cover everyone, put your best/fastest CB on their worst WR and dont bump. if your CBs suck, or their WRs are all studs, this can be tricky. otherwise, and especially in longer downs, just put the other saftey in a deep zone (shift the other one over first, then put that saftey in a deep zone and control him). sure, you give up man coverage on a RB/FB/TE, but they arent the biggest threats at that time. mixing in these plays, especially after youve played man D with 2 safties over the top, will usually suprise your opponent. dont abuse these cover 1 plays, cuz a good player will kill you if you do. again, none of these are nanos, and all can be picked up with the right blocking scheme, the idea here is that if you mix this in with 2 man under, your opponent will usually just keep a RB/FB in to block on whatever side they thing the LB is blitzing from. if you bring 2 LBs, you can usually get more pressure on the QB than they though was coming.

[feardaram]

6. playing zone

the 2 keys to playing an effective zone is: 1. show the offense one thing, then do something else. 2. put defenders where the offense likes to throw, blitz the rest. alot of times ill pick a zone play, then just find a LB (or 2 or 3) to blitz, based on where my opponent likes to throw the ball. most people look to the flats when they see a blitz coming, so the flats are usually my number 1 priority. ill take cover 2 zone, and blitz 1 or both OLBs. cover 3 and blitz the LOLB (on the right of your screen), and put the SS in a flat zone, or blitz the FS. cover 4 zone and blitz any combo of LBs (both MLBs, both OLBs, one MLB and one OLB, etc), and if its a shorter yardage situation, make sure i still have flat coverage (either from the LBs not blitzing, or from the safteys). the idea here is to confuse, forcing the D to hold on to the ball. most people are only used to generic zone blitzes, that leave the flats open. when they arent, that extra second they hold on to the ball and say WTF can be enough to get you the sack. once i blitz a few times, i then go all out zone, to throw in another wrinkle.

straight zone plays i like: cover 2, cover 3, cover 4. all of these can be modified to bring some pressure.

some zone blitz plays i like:

1. LB Storm 3 (3-4 normal). this play can be ran as it is, but i usually put the CB on the left into a flat zone, and put the LOLB (on your right) into a flat zone, or leave him as it is to protect against a quick hitter to the TE. the 3 other blitzing LBs should get to the QB pretty quickly. i use the SS, and roam the middle.

2. weak storm roll. i usually put the MLB #1 (on your right) into a flat zone. then i usually blitz the CB on your left, and put the other MLB into a flat zone. so you have cover 3, a purple zone on the right of the screen, flat coverage on both sides, and you control the SS and police the middle. this can get some pressure with the OLB blitzing, and the CB flying in from the side will cause some major disruptions to the offense. this D has its holes, but only if the offense does 1 thing, overload the middle. like i said, alot of guys look to the flats with their TE/RBs, which you have covered.

3. trio sky zone. get some flat coverage (if it isnt 3rd and long), by putting the a combo of the ILBs/FS/ROLB (the one who isnt blitzing) into the flats). flip it to get the purple zone on the TE side, if the O likes corner routes alot.

4. crash blitz. some LBs blitz while your Dline drops back, and a cb comes in. throw in some flat zones if needed.

as you see, you can do just about anything, no matter what the play. you can also use engage 8, and put guys in coverage the way that you want them. all of that is effective. there are a bunch of other effective zone plays, just make sure to zone guys where the O likes to throw.

7. playing a man/zone combo

i mix these in once ive shown what i like to do with all man or all zone coverage. plays i like:

1. exchange (only use if you have a somewhat fast DE): this play has your LE (on the right of your screen) manned up on the TE/FB/RB. the 2 MLBs are in hook zones, one OLB is blitzing, the other is in man. both CBs are in man, with 2 safties deep. i love this play, cuz no one expects the DE to man up on someone. i have gotten picks with my DE, its pretty awesome.

2. CB Dogs Blitz: both CBs are blitzing. i put each OLB in a flat zone (sometimes just one). you gotta watch the deep ball here. control the saftey to the side of the fasest/best/biggest threat. there isnt any immediate pressure, but the CBs will get there if the ball is held on to.

3. zone-man blitz: i run it just how it is. a FB or RB is left uncovered, so you can put a DE to a flat zone on side if you feel like it. good for some confusion.

4. FS blitz. i usually move the FS down in the box. you have people manned up underneath, and cover 3 deep. brings pressure from an unexpected place.

8. bringing it all together

on their own, none of these plays are that special. none will hit the QB on their 2nd step of their drop, nor will cover every area of the field. the idea is to just keep them guessing about which, if any, of your LBs/CBs/Safties are blitzing. since you have guys who can come around the outside, and you have spread your line, the O really has to have backs/TEs blocking to that side, or the blitz will get there. once they look to block the outside, blitz the MLBs, etc. you are looking to try to get pressure, are willing to give up some gains, but arent willing to give up the big play. you are hoping, before they score a TD, you can get a sack to force a FG (or take them out of range), get a INT, a fumble, etc. make them work for their points. if they beat you, they beat you, but atleast you didnt just give it to them. seeing as how i play like this, i dont use cover 0 blitzes. no matter what, ill have atleast 1, but preferably 2 safties deep at all times.

9. Other plays i like from the 3-4 book

2-4-5 2 man under. spread dline (but dont loop), spread LBs, and blitz the ROLB (on the left), to take away that weird stunt. gets good pressure from the outside.

dime 3-2-6 2 deep LB blitz. spread and loop line, shift the blitzing LB to his side. if you notice, his blitz angle wont change (usually when moving a blitzer his blitz agle shifts towards teh QB, and the blitzer just runs into the Oline), he runs straight down after the snap and around the Oline.

anything from the 1-1-5s. so many ways to blitz Lbs and safties.

[NinersFaithful]

Wow. This is a great read!!! You have a great understanding of the 3-4... Dick Lambeau would be proud! Thanks for the basics on this defense, I'm going to work on these ideas today and hopefully it should work with my Niners. Thanks again!

[Pat]

this is great stuff, thanks a lot.
you got me wanting to run a 3-4 now. :D

[daone]

great stuff...I have some blitz setups for the 3-4...you checked out 3-4 solid...I will post this later today (got an essay to write)

[wazaflo]

Awesome! Thanks!

[madnfreak25]

I'm in the same situation, like playin' as the Patriots who don't have a lot of speed at linebacker, but have a good d-playbook. Will put this info to use and try and expand on this write-up. Keep posting.

[daone]

instead of doing my own 3-4 write up I will just contribute to others :)

To me the biggest advantage to the 3-4 is how you can generate what would be 5 man pressure out of any other set with just 4 men, and with 5 man pressure the heat is insane.

So I labbed for about an hour last night and found this about the 3-4 YOU CAN GET INSANE GAP HEAT EASILY

A gap:
Here the idea is for the DEs to man up with the Gs and the NT to take the C. Then both A gaps will be open. Infuriately the Ts can suck out the DEs putting the blitzing ILBs on a G. This nullifies the pass rush. GOD DAMN SUCTION BLOCKING
Yet, there are ways to combat this. I found three.
1.) Ignore it, use the right formation, and out of the right formation the Ts only pull the DEs about 25% of the time.
2.) Blitz an OLB; he will engage the T eliminating the possibility of the T pulling the DE.
3.) Put an OLB in flat coverage. This will cause the T to wait to block him.

!NOTE! While setting up A gap heat you want the ILB/ILBS lined up right between the NT and DE. It should look like he is slapping there asses. You also want to shift the LBs until you find the straightest blitzing angles. !NOTE!

B Gap:
With line shifts the DE and NT will engage the T and G leaving B gap wide open. The only way this can be stopped is by suction blocking, when the C pulls out the NT. This leaves your LB stuck with the G. However this can be counteracted 3 ways to bring a sick blitz:
1.) Ignore it, use the right formation, out of the right formation the C only pulls the NT about 25% of the time.
2.) Blitz an ILB this is the best way. Here the C has to choose who to block the NT or the ILB if he blocks the NT the ILB gets through as the other DE holds up a guard. Yet if the C blocks the ILB the OLB or other ILB shoots through.
3.) Put an ILB in the flat zone (light blue zone) on the blitz OLBs side and put him in between the NT and DE, this should place him right in front of the C, now bring him down really far. What will happen is the C will stay in place to block the ILB who will then run out to the flats. This leaves the B gap wide open.

!NOTE! While setting up B gap heat you want to use the LB with the best blitzing angle, either slightly inwards or straight down. Then place the OLB or ILB right over the T he should be on a line with the DL. !NOTE!

C gap:
This is the easiest heat to get. However a blocking back can stop this and nothing can be done. However most OLBs or DEs will plow over a HB or FB, and suction blocking doesn’t hurt you. The only problem here is random blitz angles. These can’t be stopped here unlike with A and B gap heat. This is also easy heat to set up, there are 2 ways.
1.) Shift and crash the line towards the side you want to bring the heat from. Then slide the LBs the OPPOSITE WAY, and blitz the OLB on the side you want to blitz. If he is place right over the DE this blitz is more effective, but it is not necessary.
2.) Spread the line, crash it out, spread the LBs and blitz both OLBs, this is really effective, until they run it up the gut.

Examples:

A Gap Heat:
3-4 Solid
Pinch DL
Crash DL Out
Blitz LILB
Optional: Blitz RILB also, or Blitz OLBs, or Put OLBS in flats

B Gap Heat:

3-4 Normal FLIPPED:
(for normal not flipped just do the opposite)
Slide Line Right
Slide LBs Left
Blitz the ROLB between the NT and the LDE
Optional: Blitz the RILB onto the C or put him in a flat zone

3-4 Under FLIPPED:
(for under not flipped just do the opposite)
Slide line Left
Pinch LBS
Blitz the LILB
Optional: Optional: Blitz the RILB onto the C or put him in a flat zone

3-4 Solid:
Slide the Line left
Crash the Line Out
LILB Blitz
Optional: Optional: Blitz the RILB onto the C or put him in a flat zone

C Gap Heat:

3-4 Normal
Spread the Line
Crash the Line Out
Blitz the LOLB and ROLB

3-4 Normal
(flip for left side heat)
Shift the line Right
Crash the line Right
Shift the LBs left
Blitz the ROLB
Optional Blitz RILB or put him in a flat zone

3-4 Solid
(flip for left side heat)
Shift the line Right
Crash the line Right
Shift the LBs left
Blitz the ROLB
Optional Blitz RILB or put him in a flat zone

P.S. FeardaArm I am going to copy your post into mine, with your permission so it is easier to read.

[TONY 4 MVP]

Nice read Fear , ive really never thought about using 3-4 until now.

BTW fellas the play he suggests to stop the stretch play really does work, trust me I know. lol;)

[Dazed N Confuse]

I'm in the same situation, like playin' as the Patriots who don't have a lot of speed at linebacker, but have a good d-playbook. Will put this info to use and try and expand on this write-up. Keep posting.


I use the Pats in a league. I will let you know If (Thats a big if) I find anything that seems to work well.

[zerowley]

Good thread. Your counter to the stretch play is extremely useful (I've run into quite a few people that use it well), and the rest of the stuff provides a damn good foundation to work with. Thanks for sharing.

[BOOBOOSD]

Good stuff man, you & Daone. :)

[feardaram]

the main thing i like about the 3-4 is the versitility. instead of having a slow and useless DT, you get an extra LB. this allows you to get more speed on the field, play better all out coverage, and allows you to blitz around the outside without having to sacrifice deep or underneath coverage. you never know where pressure will come from, if it comes at all, since there are so many choices.

more tips:

1. if your opponent comes out in a twin wr or some kind of spread/tight set, and you are in zone, where if you dont freeze the D your LBs might shift out, you can playmaker the LBs to blitz (for the OLBs right analog stick to the right or left for which OLB you want), and they will still shift like they are in coverage. this is great for coming out in cover 2/3/4, and blitzing both OLBs. they will still shift out over the WRs/TEs like they are in coverage, yet will be bringing some very unexpected heat.

2. dont use defensive assignments. if your opponent uses a twin WR set, and you are using assignments, your CB will actually line up at OLB, then shift infront of the WR. your OLB, will line up at cb, then shift over the TE. so basically youll be missing your ROLB (on the left of your screen) because he will line up on the very right of your screen. sure, you can use triangle left to line everyone up, but then you give away coverage, and screw up the alignment i use most of the time. HB blasts are money to the weak side when the OLB lines up at CB.

and good work to daone. his blitzes probably do a bit better to bring heat than anything i have. the bad thing is that alot of them rely on odd alignments, that might either give away where the pressure is coming from, or might not work well against the run. i like that my D always lines up the same, regardless of what im actually doing, and is always in position to stop the run. both things can be useful in specific situations.

[Brutal Attack]

the main thing i like about the 3-4 is the versitility. instead of having a slow and useless DT, you get an extra LB. this allows you to get more speed on the field, play better all out coverage, and allows you to blitz around the outside without having to sacrifice deep or underneath coverage. you never know where pressure will come from, if it comes at all, since there are so many choices.

more tips:

1. if your opponent comes out in a twin wr or some kind of spread/tight set, and you are in zone, where if you dont freeze the D your LBs might shift out, you can playmaker the LBs to blitz (for the OLBs right analog stick to the right or left for which OLB you want), and they will still shift like they are in coverage. this is great for coming out in cover 2/3/4, and blitzing both OLBs. they will still shift out over the WRs/TEs like they are in coverage, yet will be bringing some very unexpected heat.

2. dont use defensive assignments. if your opponent uses a twin WR set, and you are using assignments, your CB will actually line up at OLB, then shift infront of the WR. your OLB, will line up at cb, then shift over the TE. so basically youll be missing your ROLB (on the left of your screen) because he will line up on the very right of your screen. sure, you can use triangle left to line everyone up, but then you give away coverage, and screw up the alignment i use most of the time. HB blasts are money to the weak side when the OLB lines up at CB.

and good work to daone. his blitzes probably do a bit better to bring heat than anything i have. the bad thing is that alot of them rely on odd alignments, that might either give away where the pressure is coming from, or might not work well against the run. i like that my D always lines up the same, regardless of what im actually doing, and is always in position to stop the run. both things can be useful in specific situations.


As far as personnel goes:

The Dolphins only have 2 good linebackers. That is why, in real life, they stand up Jason Taylor in their 3-4 sets. I do this in my franchise and it works really well. Taylor is of course a freak and he plays well at OLB, he can cove or blitz because of his speed. This is a pretty good formation as it puts Roth at DE and Taylor at OLB on the same side.

Obviously you can do this with any DE that has good SPD (probably 78+) and ACC. So if you have 3 good LBs from a 4-3 scheme, you can use one of your DEs as a OLB in 3-4 sets. This is what they call a "hybrid" defense. It also helps to have a serviceable backup DE.

[zerowley]

I've been messing around with your set-up/scheme a little bit and have a few questions. Do you usually switch to Nickel/Dime/Quarter sets when the offense comes out with more than 2 WR's or just stay in your 3-4? If you switch, which Nickel formation do you prefer?

I couldn't find an effective set-up for the 3-3-5 or 2-4-5 that did anything to slow the run game, and 1-5-5 and Prowl were kind of hit and miss. Sometimes runs would get blown up behind the LOS and other times I'd get nailed with a 50 yard run (this was in practice mode, as I'm not comfortable enough with it to use it in a game yet). Any suggestions (I was using the Cowboys, BTW)?

If I'm asking too much just let me know, as you've already shared plenty.

[Brutal Attack]

I've been messing around with your set-up/scheme a little bit and have a few questions. Do you usually switch to Nickel/Dime/Quarter sets when the offense comes out with more than 2 WR's or just stay in your 3-4? If you switch, which Nickel formation do you prefer?



I know you didn't ask me but I thought I would chime in.

It really depends on where I'm at on the field, how fast my LBs are and how fast the 3 and 4th WRs are.

If they are inside my 20 then I go with 3-4 all the time until it's time for goalline. Your LBers can cover man-to-man because there isn't enough field for them to get beat by fast WRs (usually), your safety help is quick there and you don't have to worry about your safety covering the TE for your blitzing LBer (which you usually do in other parts of the field). Alternatively, your LBers can fall back into zone coverage which is fine because you don't have much to fear from burner WRs inside the 20.

If I'm on other parts of the field, then it all depends on how fast my LBers are and how fast the 3rd and 4th WRs are.

If I have a real fast LBer (like 81+) I will match him up with a possession reciever, if they have one, and put any slower LBers into zones or blitzes.

If you go straight man with a 3-4 vs. a 3 or 4 WR set it won't be hard for them to gain yardage underneath as your slower LBers trail the faster WRs. And at worst they could go vertical and your safeties may not be able to pick everyone up.

If you go zone with a 3-4 you might be ok as most of the passing plays only send one or at most 2 guys deep so even if your CBs aren't on the deep guys your safeties can usually pick them up. Assuming one of your LBers can cover the TE (if any) without getting beat deep. Going with a zone also helps eliminate the yardage underneath. Sitting in a 3-4 zone when they have 3 or 4 WR sets really helps eliminate any WR running after the catch too. The only problem with this type of coverage is that it's vulnerable to seam routes by the TE or a WR in motion, and again if any LBer has to cover a WR on a deep route he could be in trouble if the safety on that side of the field has too much to handle.

If they have burner WRs I usually just go with a nickel or dime coverage to be safe. Then your LBer can go free to cover the flat or spy, which is important because alot of times the offense can gain much yardage by sending everyone out then throwing to the flat or scrambling.

[BOOBOOSD]

I guess I'll chime in also.


Since I have fast LBs, yes I try to stay in the 3-4 as long as possible. But the more WRs you come out with (3+WRs), you best believe the more heat I'll send or I'll overload so a 4th or 5th rusher has a great chance of getting in quickly to force the quick pass. If I go man coverage I usually will start off with the DoubleZ, DoubleX, DoubleTE plays enhanced to 2Man Under and start adding in heat on the fly if I feel the need to and playmaker safeties to man SlotWRs,etc..., but don't tip it off. Eventually a Cover2 man under could turn into a Cover1 or Cover0 depending on how I feel the heat will get in and my opponent's tendencies. I usually won't bump if I go Cover0/1, I actually will individually back up the corners and shade if needed, just try to contain. All this works best against non-compression sets though, more spread out type sets.

However, the safest way to go IMO if you plan on using the 3-4 the entire game regardless of the offensive package, is to use more Zone blitzes if they go 3+WRs. It's a bit easier to contain a speedier offensive package that way IMO since you don't have to run the risk of manning up slower LBs/Safeties on faster SlotWRs. Just blitz hard and try to contain the middle especially because more often than not when your opponent comes out with 3+WRs, quick passes will go over the middle and to the flats to the SlotWRs. I actually sometimes like mixing in a lot of heavy blitz Cover2 setups if flats become a problem and you don't really have to worry about the deep ball that much if the heat is getting in insanely quick, just fan safeties out and take control of a ILB to guard the middle. That's when Cover2 zones can actually be OK to run IMO if you bring the heat vs. those spread sets and it's nice out of the 3-4 cuz you got the "Sink" plays also.

I do like to mix in the Nickel-2-4-5 other than the 3-4. That's pretty much all I really like to use, the 3-4 & 2-4-5. Their both so similiar and I use a lot of the same concepts with both. Some 3-3-5, 1-5-5, 3-2-6 & Quarter ain't bad also though, but I personally don't use them as much or if I do I play a bit more vanilla with them. Also when the offense uses more compression sets I find it best to use more Nickel, Dime or Quarter that way you avoid confusion with the LBs/Safeties and or use more Zone blitzes with frozen Defense. So I do open up a lot of my defensive playbook, but I open it up more if I use man coverage, if I go more Zone I feel very comfortable with just the base 3-4 & Nickel-2-4-5 regardless of the offensive personnel. Just bring the f-ing HEAT!

[Virtruvious]

Great Post- A Quick Question:

I run a 3-4 defense and I've always read that the 3-4's strength is that it can "disguise the 4th rusher" whereas the 4-3 has the same 4 rushers each down. But I noticed that all the zone coverages (in normal, under, over, and solid) only rush the 3 linemen. Now I can manually blitz a linebacker to create the 4th rusher, but why isn't this automatically assigned? Has anyone else thought about this? And what about the 360 guys who can't playmaker the defense???

The double X/Z/TE plays do rush a linebacker automatically but I prefer to play zone coverage. This is more of what I expect from the 3-4.

[feardaram]

Great Post- A Quick Question:

I run a 3-4 defense and I've always read that the 3-4's strength is that it can "disguise the 4th rusher" whereas the 4-3 has the same 4 rushers each down. But I noticed that all the zone coverages (in normal, under, over, and solid) only rush the 3 linemen. Now I can manually blitz a linebacker to create the 4th rusher, but why isn't this automatically assigned? Has anyone else thought about this? And what about the 360 guys who can't playmaker the defense???

The double X/Z/TE plays do rush a linebacker automatically but I prefer to play zone coverage. This is more of what I expect from the 3-4.
there are plenty of 3-4 plays that are zone blitzes straight from the play call screen. some bring 1 to 3 LBs, CBs, some have the lineman drop back in coverage, etc. you dont have to choose an all out zone and then playmaker someone to blitz, its just convenient and flexible. the main thing is that most of the 3-4 zone blitzes are all out blitzs, or ones with little or no flat coverage. i modify almost every play i call, some very slightly, some drastically. basically, if you want to get creative on D, playing on the 360 is not the way to go.

[BOOBOOSD]

Great Post- A Quick Question:

I run a 3-4 defense and I've always read that the 3-4's strength is that it can "disguise the 4th rusher" whereas the 4-3 has the same 4 rushers each down. But I noticed that all the zone coverages (in normal, under, over, and solid) only rush the 3 linemen. Now I can manually blitz a linebacker to create the 4th rusher, but why isn't this automatically assigned? Has anyone else thought about this? And what about the 360 guys who can't playmaker the defense???

The double X/Z/TE plays do rush a linebacker automatically but I prefer to play zone coverage. This is more of what I expect from the 3-4.

Yeah I know exactly what your talking about and that's the way it is for all the vanilla Zone coverages in the 3-4, they all seem to rush only 3 by defualt, as compared to the 4-3, they all rush 4 with the front 4. That's kind of my only gripe about the 3-4 playbook. Your basically forced to create your own vanilla 4 man rush zone plays and like you said if your a 360 user, your basically f-ed.

This is what I do though to create my own 4 man rush Zone plays from 3-4, for example...

Take a regular 3-4-Cover3, what I will then do to create a 4man pass rush is playmaker one of the OLBs to blitz, then playmaker the ILB on the same side to a flat zone or purple zone. The OLB blitzes, but the ILB on that same side takes the initial zone responsibility of that blitzing OLB. You basically roll the coverage over to compensate for that blitzing OLB. This is how they should have drawn up the defualt vanilla zone plays or atleast give you both options with the 3 man rush or 4 man rush versions.

[XRated]

Hey someone,how about a 4-3 write up?Anyone,give us 4-3 users something:)

[Virtruvious]

Yeah I know exactly what your talking about and that's the way it is for all the vanilla Zone coverages in the 3-4, they all seem to rush only 3 by defualt, as compared to the 4-3, they all rush 4 with the front 4. That's kind of my only gripe about the 3-4 playbook. Your basically forced to create your own vanilla 4 man rush zone plays and like you said if your a 360 user, your basically f-ed.

This is what I do though to create my own 4 man rush Zone plays from 3-4, for example...

Take a regular 3-4-Cover3, what I will then do to create a 4man pass rush is playmaker one of the OLBs to blitz, then playmaker the ILB on the same side to a flat zone or purple zone. The OLB blitzes, but the ILB on that same side takes the initial zone responsibility of that blitzing OLB. You basically roll the coverage over to compensate for that blitzing OLB. This is how they should have drawn up the defualt vanilla zone plays or atleast give you both options with the 3 man rush or 4 man rush versions.

Yea, that makes sense....I usually play ILB (Edwards) for San Diego, so maybe I'll just read the play and go to the flats or adjust to a purple zone. I'm going to try to playmaker some of my "vanilla" zones tonight.

But how do you do all that adjustment before the snap when someone is quickly going to the line and snapping the ball?

[GAV]

Yea, that makes sense....I usually play ILB (Edwards) for San Diego, so maybe I'll just read the play and go to the flats or adjust to a purple zone. I'm going to try to playmaker some of my "vanilla" zones tonight.

But how do you do all that adjustment before the snap when someone is quickly going to the line and snapping the ball?
Turn the player lock off in your settings. Then, you'll always
start out on your RE, allowing for quick adjustments w/o
looking to see who you're on.

[Virtruvious]

Turn the player lock off in your settings. Then, you'll always
start out on your RE, allowing for quick adjustments w/o
looking to see who you're on.

Great Tip-

I didn't know this.....

[BOOBOOSD]

Yea, that makes sense....I usually play ILB (Edwards) for San Diego, so maybe I'll just read the play and go to the flats or adjust to a purple zone. I'm going to try to playmaker some of my "vanilla" zones tonight.

But how do you do all that adjustment before the snap when someone is quickly going to the line and snapping the ball?


Exactly, blitz Merriman and on that same side you can control Edwards and watch that side manually yourself or just playmaker him to a zone such as a flat, purple or hook and play safety overtop. That's pretty much the concept. I'll tell you what, I get a lot better heat with a 4 man rush setup like this from the 3-4, than with a 4 man D-line rush from the 4-3. Reason being is that you can give that blitzing OLB a free path to the backfield by either shifting the D-line towards that blitzing OLB or spreading the D-line, it creates a nice overload off the edge and the offense is forced to use extra protection to block that blitzing OLB and that's great because that's only a 4 man rush, so the coverage is nice behind it. See if you go 4-3, it takes a dramatic D-line shift and stunt crash out of the 4-3-Over/Under to free up a DE or it takes an additional 5th rusher to get that same kind of overload heat as the 3-4 setup.

[Virtruvious]

Hey Boo-

Do you find the zone blitzes effective? I tend to get more heat from the zone blitzes because it seems the O line gets confused when they don't block a linemen and get overloaded from one side. I'll have to do more testing to say definately though.

[Virtruvious]

Hey someone,how about a 4-3 write up?Anyone,give us 4-3 users something:)

I remember seeing a thread on the 4-3 a few days ago. Maybe you could search for it. Not sure how helpfull it is though.

My understanding of the 4-3 (against the pass) is to have the DE's get upfield as quick as possible and surround the QB. Then the DT's push upfield behind them to collapse the "pocket" to pressure the QB into throwing the ball before he wants to- hopefully to an area of the field where you have defenders. With the right personnel one can force a quick pass or sack with just a 4 man rush.

[daone]

Hey someone,how about a 4-3 write up?Anyone,give us 4-3 users something

can do, will take just a bit

[dmbrox]

First off, awesome post .. kudos to feardaram.
I know you mentioned that you use the 3-4 Under to stop the stretch plays.

Was wondering what is the 3-4 front you guys prefer against diff types of runs. Like

1. Counters
2. Slams/Dives
3. Stretch
4. Toss

Also I'm having trouble stopping the run from BIG sets like the sets where there are 2 TEs bunched to one side or 3 TE sets. Any ideas what works best against these BIG sets.

Keep the good stuff coming .. ;o)

[Hoodlum]

Good stuff my man.

[hollywood 662]

Hey guys i use to run a 46 and 34 withj zone an manual heat got scared of the deep ball for a couple of games. Now i say the hell with it i'm gonna bring my manual heat with ilb and double one wr pm flat zones i'm giving up to much underneath stuff. Sometimes u just gotta go with what you know.

[daone]

check out my post in the D section

[StlnKC]

those plays work really well in passing down situations, but how you stop the run in the backfield if the person like to run dives and counters??

[blueblood]

those plays work really well in passing down situations, but how you stop the run in the backfield if the person like to run dives and counters??

Okay, I'm not a defensive whiz so don't get mad if my tips don't help lol. But here's what I do.

Until my oppoent shows me they pass I always assume run on the first play. I usually call plays with both MLBs blitzing the middle. Then I'll pinch my line. After then I crash them out. This allows my MLBs to shoot the A gap well hopefully they will. Then I control the FS and take away the outside runs.

I feel with my setup that the MLBs will handle the inside run pretty well so I don't have to worry about it with the FS. It's simple but works for me. You may want to try it too.

[daone]

not to be an A@@ hole but I posted this + some in another post...

http://www.vgsportsinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62956

[blueblood]

not to be an A@@ hole but I posted this + some in another post...

http://www.vgsportsinc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62956

Yeah but I decided it would be easier to tell him then post the link. Sorry about that man.

[jaylend9]

46 Rules!!!!

[smallman01313]

can u guys help me with my run defense man i got ran on for 185 yds off of 40 atts in my league game and i did plays like pinch please tell me what to do i don't wanna get ran onlike that again

[UnDisputedChamp]

can u guys help me with my run defense man i got ran on for 185 yds off of 40 atts in my league game and i did plays like pinch please tell me what to do i don't wanna get ran onlike that again

if you're on all-madden, dont pinch your LB's a lot, unless it's short yardage, ESPECIALLY if you're playin a speedy back(93+ speed), b-cuz if they get outside of the box on you, it can be a bad thing, seeing as how CB's aren't usually good tacklers, but if you must, and you have a speedy safety that can tackle, zone him over the middle and watch the back. Follow him and when he cuts, meet him....

Otherwise try blitzing your interior LBs, spreading and looping your line, spreading your LBs and sending the outside LBs to the flats on zones. You might wanna bring a safety on this too, but only if they are 2 MAYBE 3 wide...and it's a BIG MAYBE. playactions a killer without safety help, you'll get beat deep a lot on all-madden in one on one when they go PA. even if your CBs are aware.

And if youve got slow DE's that are strong and quick LBs, pinch the D-Line, and spread the LBs, and blitz around the ends, zone 1 of your ILBs over the middle, blitz the other.(if youve got only one fast ILB, zone him and blitz the other, if theyre both fast, leave the more aware one in the zone). So if they go up the middle, they should be stuffed, and outside, your Lbs should be fast enough to get around the Tackles to shut it down. But yeah 3-4's the greatest. Hope it helps man, PE@CE

[smallman01313]

cool thnx for the help

[cromat]

Great tips,I got desire to play 3-4;)

[ICreate]

I play with the Panthers, and my D is sick. I run the 3-4 and get insane heat, coverage, turnovers, and big hits. I started running this D mainly b/c of this thread. I printed it out and I read it before every meaningful game I play.

[Ermeni]

Hi, my first post.

I started playing a 3-4 after reading this thread, and I like it a lot better b/c you can really mix things up and there is some room for creativity (except it sucks when you see something you want to do and don't have time to do it and accidentally commit). And for the most part I had no problem stopping the run for awhile. Recently I played the Bengals and I got dismantled. The pathetic thing is, I knew what he was going to do but I couldn't stop it. I play with the Ravens and Ravens/Balanced D playbook. It continued on to the point that I started using a 4-6 on certain plays (I did not want to use a 4-3).

He ran straight dives and slams and killed me right up the middle. I usually spread and loop the line but eventually I left the line regular, crashed it in and pinched the LB's (sometimes pinched line). I blitzed the ILB's, I don't know what else to try. And every now and then he would throw a deep ball PA. Anyways, I couldn't stop the inside run with the 3-4 - damn suction blocking, everybody is getting blocked and he runs right into the secondary.

Any suggestions? Sorry if the solution is already posted somewhere. When I pinch the line, BTW, he often heads outside. I just really could not stop the run at all.

EDIT: I was usually running man plays on the dives/slams. My defense pretty much depended on someone getting free from a block, and even then we would pick up 2-3 yards. BTW, he most often used Strong I (normal) and Singleback Big.

[smallman01313]

hey try to stack ur lb's over ur d-lineman which means u take 3 lb's and put em right behind each d-lineman and probably u can move the 4th lb to the middle of the field between the safeties and lb's it's kind of a hard setup though

[pitbull]

i really like this def. i use bal. def. PB and use the 3-4 when my opponent comes out w/ 2 WR and if i thik they're going to run. the outside run is near imposible w/ how far out the OLB's are, i pinch th D-line and stack the MLB's to stop the run between the tackles.

[smallman01313]

guys what do ya'll do to stop goalline and jumbo users because i run the 3-4 pb and In the pb i have 1-5-5 idk how to stop the jumbo in it

[Jay6Cutler]

i play with denver i this is what i put for my DLine LDE dumerville Tackle Warren RDE C.brown or Lang
my LB are Gold, Wilson, Williems my corners are Foxworth,Bailey safteys are Lynch and D.Wiliems i need help with big sets Jumbo, twin TE sets i dam near got a nano out of 3-4 normal for 3,4,5 WR set but i cant stop the big sets pitches, counters dive and slams any help i would love to help my game ill give you a good blitz it the 3-4 pinch spread the dline and bump the WR this play will get you a ton of sack the ajustments are easy and it very affective :D

[coachkody]

This is so beautifull:p I love the 3-4 now as I hated it before. THANK You For this post

[Exilestate]

wow, thanks for all the tips and info.

[Blayzed4life]

Wow how do you guys make all these adjustments to your plays before your opponent snaps the ball?!? damn that sounds like so much changes what if they snap the ball right away?

[35BigHurt35]

Wow how do you guys make all these adjustments to your plays before your opponent snaps the ball?!? damn that sounds like so much changes what if they snap the ball right away?

Do your shifts and the movemtns like that right as you break the huddle and are walking to the line, that way if you choose to adjust individual men you can do so after they take the line of scrimmage.

[tony_touch16365]

I'm just beginning to incorporate the 3-4 defense into my scheme. I've always been a big fan of 4-DLs, but I have seen the benefits of running the 3-4. My question is: "I have problems defending out patterns (a lot) and the corner route (high pass); what would you do for this out of the 3-4 set or any other? It's really the Achilles' Heel of my defense. I'm pretty good against the run, in most cases, and I often have my opponent in 3rd and 7-10, but those 2 routes, even when I use the purple zone, seem to hurt me. I play mostly league games, and it seems that these two plays are most often run in these situations. HELP!!!

[ewhodi]

dammmm good stuff right here i just started running the 3-4 and the 3-4 under is amazing againt the runs i can finally shutdown this dude who uses the panthers yesss and i feel like it causes more turnovers because they try to cut or bounce to the outside and if you have an ok stick you can pop them for a fumble with the SS or LB

[BOOBOOSD]

I'm just beginning to incorporate the 3-4 defense into my scheme. I've always been a big fan of 4-DLs, but I have seen the benefits of running the 3-4. My question is: "I have problems defending out patterns (a lot) and the corner route (high pass); what would you do for this out of the 3-4 set or any other? It's really the Achilles' Heel of my defense. I'm pretty good against the run, in most cases, and I often have my opponent in 3rd and 7-10, but those 2 routes, even when I use the purple zone, seem to hurt me. I play mostly league games, and it seems that these two plays are most often run in these situations. HELP!!!

A combination of heat and coverage can help because those routes take time to develope. From a Cover3 shell, send an OLB off the edge from that problematic side and either have the closest ILB or Safety, zone that area with either a flat or purple zone. Try modifying Engage8 or a play like TrioSkyZone, it's the quickest way IMO because alls you then have to do is playmaker a few zones here and there. The heat should force your opponent to either throw it quicker before the route fully developes or it should force your opponent to roll opposite of the heat which should then create a bad angle to pass if he still wants to throw that out or corner route. He'll most likely have to throw across the field which is bad and can create INTs. Most outs or corner routes require a slight QB rollout to create a better passing angle, that's why the heat can help out, it should keep the QB in check. Also if the heat becomes too great, your opponent might possibly hotroute the TE to block, thus eliminating him as a recieving threat. It's just something to try, I find it works nicely for containment. Try playmakering the DE opposite of the blitzing OLB to a QB Contain, that can further keep the QB in check and create sacks. You might not always get the INT or deflected pass, but usually you get the quick tackle and minimal gain.

I like to use man under in the same way as well. If you decide to go "2Man Under" from the 3-4, use plays like DoubleX/Z/TE instead of the traditional 2Man under play. Those plays have 1OLB blitzing off the edge which will create a nice 4 man rush, but FLIP the play if you have to so the blitzing OLB blitzes off the problematic side. You also will probably want to playmaker the safety in double man coverage to a deep zone and then shift the zone more towards his side and then control the opposite safety and vice versa to create that 2 man under. And at times instead of blitzing that OLB, playmaker him to a flat or purple zone or even man. With the Nickel-2-4-5 you can do similiar, instead of always rushing those 2 OLBs from a play like 2Man Under, you can playmaker them to a zone or man at times.

[Paid In FuLL]

dont fast developing running plays up the middle with a fb kill the spread and loop and pinch the lbs?? because if i do a dive i got virtually 4 blockers hitting the 2nd level of ur defense the guard has no1 lined up over him so hes going for the lb my fb is following him getting the next man which is the saftey and my other guard is getting that other lb who is uncovered


kind of hard to explain but if i had a screen shot you could see

[MaddenSensa]

I personally dont like, or run 3-4 defensive schemes. Usually because they never work on the type of people I play like my cousin who is a heavy runner, and abuses the ravens run game. Just saying

[malicea89]

help any1
me play better

[malicea89]

any1 help me become better

[malicea89]

ok i am the best in madden 09 but i need help 2 user catch any1 got anything 4 me

[Militant X 1]

I personally dont like, or run 3-4 defensive schemes. Usually because they never work on the type of people I play like my cousin who is a heavy runner, and abuses the ravens run game. Just saying

lol! yeah...my Ravens running game can do some damage! :cool:

[Militant X 1]

im not good at this game, but i seem to run a relatively solid 3-4 defense,

1. personell for the 3-4

the first thing you would want would be atleast 3, but preferably 4 good LBs (san diego, bengals, steelers, bears, etc)

Ram? i know you said, "etc" at the end....but how in the world could you not mention my RAVENS LBing core bruh? :cool:

GREAT POST!!

[mightypharaoh]

Ram? i know you said, "etc" at the end....but how in the world could you not mention my RAVENS LBing core bruh? :cool:

GREAT POST!!

my dude did you also know that the 1st post was in 2006?!?!?!?!? :confused: :D

[Militant X 1]

my dude did you also know that the 1st post was in 2006?!?!?!?!? :confused: :D

yeah my dude i did! however, you NEVER leave out the Ravens LBs when talking about the 3-4. whether it is 2000, 2002, 2004 or 2009! :cool:

[justncredible79]

yeah my dude i did! however, you NEVER leave out the Ravens LBs when talking about the 3-4. whether it is 2000, 2002, 2004 or 2009! :cool:

LOL add the saints from 87-93 3-4 Defense...:D

[TwelveTone]

Thanks so much! I've been labbing the zone blitz plays against the computer (All-Madden) with the Chiefs D vs. the Patriots. I have the CPU offensive playbook set on random plays and I'm getting a sack on EVERY pass play, literally, even if it's delayed everyone's being covered and eventually the heat gets to the QB. The great part is how fast it is to setup. You can easily blitz the two OLB's without having to manually control them individually by just hitting R1+RS right and R1 + RS left, then simply putting the SS in the flats stops up the TE's. You can just keep your user control on one of the safeties, only takes about 2 sec to set it up.

BTW, I just posted a thread on trying to use the 3-4 successfully with the Chiefs so that I can stay loyal. This definitely has given me some confidence. I just have to really get some of these plays down.

[nikole95.7]

As far as personnel goes:

The Dolphins only have 2 good linebackers. That is why, in real life, they stand up Jason Taylor in their 3-4 sets. I do this in my franchise and it works really well. Taylor is of course a freak and he plays well at OLB, he can cove or blitz because of his speed. This is a pretty good formation as it puts Roth at DE and Taylor at OLB on the same side.

Obviously you can do this with any DE that has good SPD (probably 78+) and ACC. So if you have 3 good LBs from a 4-3 scheme, you can use one of your DEs as a OLB in 3-4 sets. This is what they call a "hybrid" defense. It also helps to have a serviceable backup DE.

I couldn't find an effective set-up for the 3-3-5 or 2-4-5 that did anything to slow the run game, and 1-5-5 and Prowl were kind of hit and miss. Sometimes runs would get blown up behind the LOS and other times I'd get nailed with a 50 yard run

[G00$E_E66z]

Nice post and good looking on the blitzes you guys it just helps me see more ways to create my own. I will post some blitzes sooner than later, thx again

[GMilfDolFan4LiF]

I'm still using the PS2; having difficulty with pass coverage and run defense. When I'm in press or any coverage for that matter,; while covering a different side of the field my defender is always getting beat!! It's so frustrating... @ the onset of the play is there something I need to press or hold down on the controller to avoid this from continually happening... Pretty much same thing for the run defense... I try to get in the back field before plays start to interrupt the timing of the run game, but I'm having a hard time... I keep getting handled @ the point of attack!!! Please help me someone!!!

[hafiz mshahid]

Because you can have a number there that wouldn't show up when you find the derivative, right?

[pirates15]

Very nice. I agree with most of all the info. The only thing that sticks out, is that the 34 defense is deadly in zone blitz. SO BE CREATIVE!!! you can literally mess around in the lab and find a custom zone blitz from scratch that most of the time will only work with a 34. for example...

i have been working on a shutdown VICK defense. and a lot of the plays are zone blitzing off the edge with contain on the opposite side.

ex. 3-4 Normal - SS Blitz (3rd down and medium obvious passing situation play)
Spread D-Line
Slant D-line to left
Spy DT
Put RE(offensive left) on contain
LOLB on flat
LILB on hook over LG.
Alert short pass because of pressure.