Does anyone play with NFL rules?

[TNT713]

I've been reading around the net about how unrealistic playing Madden online has become. So much in fact, that there are a number of unrealisitc guidelines for what makes a player "STR8."

Then the thought occurred to me... Who uses the NFL rules?

Apparently, from the looks of how many people refuse to play anyone without first checking to see if they are "str8", not many of us.

NFL Rules say:

The ball can be snapped at anytime as long as only 1 player is moving either parallel or backwards.

Str8 Rules say:

The ball cannot be snapped when a man is in motion unless he is outside the tackle box (similar to intentional grounding).

The problem here is that teams that seek to run routes into the middle, not allowed to utilize WR to chip block on the defenses best pass rusher, and not allowed to rub off defenders in man coverage by running them through traffic. All of these principles are the very reasons that motion evolved since the 1920's.

NFL Rules say:

All substitutions are legal so long as any offensive player with an ineligible number (60-79) reports to the referee that he will be eligible on a particular play.

Str8 Rules say:

Substitutions are limited (depending on which set of rules you use) so that WR can never line up as a TE, HB, or FB. DBs are not allowed to play as LB or D-linemen.

The problem with this rule is that it removes the ability for a coach to utilize his tools, namely speed, to his/her advantage. Without speed mismatches, teams need not seek ways to prevent speed mismatches. Hence removing one of the most basic and fundamental principles of football.

I'd go further... but I'm interested in hearing you guys take on this issue.

Later

[justncredible79]

the problem is that people use tactics to confuse the a.i. and gain advantage. Not necessarily to utilize strengths and mismatches but just to take advantage of the a.i. Its one thing when these tactics(motion glitches, jetpacking, etc) are used sparingly, but most only play to win, not for a good sim game, and repeatedly abuse them.

[TNT713]

What tactics confue the AI?
How is the AI confused?

The reason I ask, is because I've never had anyone answer these questions in football terms. NEVER. Instead, most sites would rather avoid the question by banning those that ask it, instead of opening a dialog about it.

There are legitimate AI exploits (camera glitch, fake punt/hurry up glitch, etc). But for every legitimate AI deficiencies, there are several that are unsubstantiated. Fabricated, if you will, from bits and peices of truth and blended with a heaping of misunderstanding and for lack of a better term... Laziness.

Very few work hard at playing Madden. There are those that take this game VERY SERIOUSLY (ie. ME), and there are those that play to pass the time... Very few actually analyze thier game plans, thier offensive plays and their defensive coverages. Very few can tell the difference between a rotating 3 Deep Zone and a Cover 0 OLB blitz. most of them only think of thier defensive plays as man or zone...

maybe if madden players treated each game as if thier paycheck depended on the outcome of each game (like in the NFL) the landscape would change.

Until then, I pray we can do more than just bash each other and point fingers.

Later

[justncredible79]

Quoted by Qdog in general discussion thread on motion-confusing

"Here it is
This will always be in madden because it it difficult to code. In Man to Man, at some point the defender has to pass assignment to another defender. The programmer has to code it. Just after the assignment switch, the original defender's assignment is changed (likely to a RB or TE). It is at that moment when people snap the ball. The defender(s) are out of position to defense their new assignment. Most motion glitches work this way. You can go to the lab and do this yourself.
In real football, the defenders communicate to each other during the play. Add to that, the complexity and the number of defenses that the offense sees, there is very little "motion glitch".

[TNT713]

OK... I read the same thing at another post.

So... how is the AI expoited... sounds like a weakness in the coverage to me. If I was a defensive coordinator of a team (like I am everytime I'm on defense) and my opponent snapped the ball with a stacked receiver alignment, there would always be a defender in a zone near the most vulnerable part of my "man" defenses. Straight man defenses would NEVER be used.

But then again... It should never be expected that the person calling the plays actually call the RIGHT plays in order to stop the other team... It is much easier to say it's a glitch. That give the defense the right to run bad coverages against good plays without accepting the responsibility for doing it... If it works, the other guy must have cheated.

Nah... there are coverages that have weaknesses. This is one of the weaknesses of running straight man coverage. Expect it in 2005.

Later

[justncredible79]

Man its kool though. Everyone plays the game the way they want to. No one is right or wrong. Its just some people have standards that they play by. Me personally, wouldnt motion wr behind the te and hike vs man defense. That gets old and boring to see that wr wide open in the flat. I could run a whole game on two plays if i chose too, using motion glitch vs. man and jetpack deep all game vs zone. Now is that going to be a fun game??? No it wont be. Everyone has their own style. Hey, you paid your $50 bucks for this game do what you want with it. But I choose not to play individuals that use these tactics. Its not that I cant defend them or perform them myself. I can audible to man flats or a quick zone vs the motion glitch. I can defend the jetpacking. It just makes a better gaming experience when the b.s., and yes it is b.s, is not used. To each his own, but i dont want no part of it man. Good luck.

[TNT713]

Did I miss something?

If you can easily adjust to it by audibling to a Man Flats... How is it still BS much less a glitch?

Aren't you SUPPOSED to adjust? If you would rather not adjust, then are you looking for games with rookies?

Adjusting is just as big a part of the game as anything else. When you make the right adjustments, it's a FUN GAME.

I hate playing guys that run 1 play the whole game when it's not working. If it is working, it's up to me to find the right adjustment(s). When I can... It's a FUN GAME. When I can't, I lose like a man, learn from it, and find a way even if it means abandoning my original gameplan (which happens alot).

Don't make the mistake that joeT made and assume that my game uses the so called "motion glitch." My game can stop it though...

Later

[dirtfield]

the points is how fun is it to defend 1 or 2 plays the whole game? whether or not they can be defended

[Gtrght77]

i played tnt the other day and you know what he was hardly nfl style foot baller. he used a motion glitch on almost every play and tended to use the same pass plays over and over again. say what you will about me but i dont waste my time playing against anyone that strays from simulation foot ball. frankly i have played so many cheese games that i almost hate madden 04 now. i just look for super str8 players now. and for your info i quit the game regardless of the score the other day i was up 14 points but becasue i burned this stupid idiot on 2 plays that meant i was cheese so he went into one play mode. i told him to stop he said if you are going to throw deep all game ill play like this. so i quit there (record means nothing its about having fun)

[TNT713]

gtrght,

Shame on you... You ran cover 2 on 80% of your defensive plays. So I audibled to my cover 2 killer. I told you to STOP RUNNING COVER 2. You didn't and you paid for it.

That Motion glitch you said I run... NOT.
Now you try to act like you quit as some noble gesture. NOT.

Fact is... we played the night before. I stomped you. So you asked for a rematch and I stomped you again. Not because of a glitch, or an AI buster... but because you did the same thing over and over. Why is it a crime if I keep beating you over and over?

By the way... GG, Quitter.

Later