Rhombic vs #1 player online

[rhombic21]

A 3 part series:

http://stage6.divx.com/user/rhombic/video/1578221/OU-OSU
http://stage6.divx.com/user/rhombic/video/1578132/Iowa-Clemson
http://stage6.divx.com/user/rhombic/video/1578293/Bama-Oregon

[M-Dub?]

Nice job. He sure was in love with that PA pass from (I think) Ace Slot.

One thing I noticed on those videos is that it seems like it's a lot easier to throw on the run on NG. A lot of those passes you guys completed while scrambling/rolling out would've been incomplete or picked on CG.

[Volunteer77]

That was some good ball. What order were those games actually played?



And what bit rate/compression are you using for your videos? They look more crisp.

[rhombic21]

Played in the order posted. 2000 K/Bit per sec.

[CrHawkeye]

That's some excellent gaming there. Looks like you've really got your act together right now.

Woulda blitzed his *** more out of the PA a-y-trips, but, maybe he was calling some other stuff out of it I didn't see. FWIW: a pass commit blitz with 2 LBs outta 4-3 (inside or out) woulda killed that pass play most of the time. (like heavy said, I've been experimenting with it too...just verifying)

Impressed with how you ran with Iowa. I've struggled mightily to get a good running game gonig with them. However, might just be me. Might be focusing too much on the pass game instead.

[Fluff E Bunny]

Nice job. He sure was in love with that PA pass from (I think) Ace Slot.

One thing I noticed on those videos is that it seems like it's a lot easier to throw on the run on NG. A lot of those passes you guys completed while scrambling/rolling out would've been incomplete or picked on CG.

On most of the passes like that you'll notice that he rolls out, then stops to get his QB's footing so he'll make a better pass. A few times he was still running and the pass ended up picked.

It can be effective, but not as much as on last gen where there was no risk and plenty of reward.

[HookemHorns]

It can be effective, but not as much as on last gen where there was no risk and plenty of reward.

Not any more, you have to have your feet set on CG to get a good throw off. Even in your drop back if you just press down on the stick until you find someone open (doesn't matter if your still in the pocket when you throw) it will be picked. Throwing on the run is an exercise in futility.

[SCAR'd 4 Life]

It doesnt seem like that guy can work without a mobile QB. I dont know if Oregon's QB went down or what...but the slower pocket passing QB, he was just stuck with. Good games man. I bet the Iowa - Clemson was really frustrating

[djwill13]

GG's Rhombic. Goes back to what you and I were talking about earlier about blitzes coming wide (on containing that PA Rollout).

[rhombic21]

His money play was Ace Big Twin TE (or whatever formation that has the TE's offset on the strongside), PA Stretch. It's a max protect scheme in which both TEs automatically stay in to block. As a result, I couldn't get pressure on it consistently with a blitz. I was pass committing on virtually every single one of the times that he used that play (if you look, you can see sometimes where my guy did a hitstick).

[TONY 4 MVP]

The #1 dude didnt seem to play too cheesyyyy , gotta appreciate that... Way to take him down..

[dawg4life]

The #1 dude didnt seem to play too cheesyyyy , gotta appreciate that... Way to take him down..

are you kidding me? how many times did you see him roll out and run the same PA pass play? I guess different people have different understanding of what is cheesy and what isn't. IMO, going to your money play and excessive amount of times per game is just lame.

[rhombic21]

Sidenote: since I'm likely to be playing this guy again in the future (I'm sure he'll want rematches), does anybody know some good strategies to use against that PA pass.

The main issue that I had was that in man coverage, you have two routes that are problematic. The intermediate drag by the slot WR can get open, and the HB coming out of the backfield is often wide open because his man is coming from the other side of the field. I had some success in zone, but getting pressure on the passer was problematic.

[GAV]

are you kidding me? how many times did you see him roll out and run the same PA pass play? I guess different people have different understanding of what is cheesy and what isn't. IMO, going to your money play and excessive amount of times per game is just lame.
I disagree. That guy could ball.

Props to Rhombic. You played great.

[sparkyosu]

Good Game...

[GAV]

Sidenote: since I'm likely to be playing this guy again in the future (I'm sure he'll want rematches), does anybody know some good strategies to use against that PA pass.

The main issue that I had was that in man coverage, you have two routes that are problematic. The intermediate drag by the slot WR can get open, and the HB coming out of the backfield is often wide open because his man is coming from the other side of the field. I had some success in zone, but getting pressure on the passer was problematic.
Try the 425 Cover 3 Max. Spread the DL, pinch the LBs, and blitz them.
Then play midfield with the safety and get on the pass playmaker.

[Trojannole II]

I disagree. That guy could ball.

Props to Rhombic. You played great.

Yea, that guy could play, but, Rhombic just a better baller with alot more strategy than Ace PA Play everytime he's n trouble.

[rhombic21]

Try the 425 Cover 3 Max. Spread the DL, pinch the LBs, and blitz them.
Then play midfield with the safety and get on the pass playmaker.
I don't like the 4-2-5 defense. I prefer a base 4-3 because of it's versatility against the run and the pass without needing to always blitz a lot of people (also, most teams are set up with 4-3 personnel), so I'll need to think of something that would work from that.

[ZachArt002]

The first thing I would try is a standard cover 3 out of 4-3. Have the safety playing the short (yellow) zone be on the side that the WR running the post is on. Hot route both DEs to contain, and manually help with the safety who plays the deep zone. I have no idea if this will work, or if the post will be too deep and render the short zone safety useless.

[rhombic21]

Yeah, there are a couple issues. First, I kept trying to hot the DEs to contain, but I couldn't get it done before he snapped the ball. You can see a couple times on those videos where I got stuck controlling a DE.

The other thing that I worry about with a base cover 3 is that the intermediate drag stretching horizontally would eventually become open near the sideline, I think. If I don't get immediate pressure on the passer, that could be problematic.

I think I need to find a way to bring pressure off the weakside and then have a zone scheme that covers the strongside flat, the deep post, and the intermediate drag from the middle of the field to the far sideline.

[kcdeE]

very nice.

rhombic, have you been using sam bradford as starting qb ever since he was announced starter?

[Fluff E Bunny]

His money play was Ace Big Twin TE (or whatever formation that has the TE's offset on the strongside), PA Stretch. It's a max protect scheme in which both TEs automatically stay in to block. As a result, I couldn't get pressure on it consistently with a blitz. I was pass committing on virtually every single one of the times that he used that play (if you look, you can see sometimes where my guy did a hitstick).


There are a few overload blitzes that I would consider using when someone is doing that much PA. In the case of Ace Twin TE WR (the formation name you were looking for) play action, you want to bring speed from the outside edge on the weak side and over load it. Believe it or not, I would actually try coming out in a Nickel or Nickel 335. There is at least one play that brings the nickel back and the LB on the NB side around the DE for a blitz, which overloads the OT in this particular case.

The play he is running is called PA Stretch Go. The RB runs into the flat after the play fake, the 'slot' WR (actually the #2 wr) just does a simple cross route and the other WR does a post route that has a quick out step prior to moving to the post.

The blitz I am talking about is zone coverage, so it will look like the NB is covering the slot. I'd probably either spread the line or shift it to the TE side to try to sell that you're playing the run to that side (and I am assuming here that he's setting the play up by running the real stretch play).

I believe the blitz has the other LB drop into zone where the cross comes in and you get a two deep look. Consider shading the safeties left with a pre-snap audible so they can engage the two WR's more quickly.

Fark....I'm gonna have to go ahead and capture the dang defensive plays now so I can show you exactly what I mean.


Anyway, that formation is one of my favorites, and one of the best designed in the game. It has a plain old dive. A dive with an auto-motion TE coming across to block into the hole like a FB. A counter play off the same motion. A PA pass off the same motion. A stretch run and a PA play off the stretch. Plus it has a few solid coverage beater plays including a smash.

[cjones]

Sidenote: since I'm likely to be playing this guy again in the future (I'm sure he'll want rematches), does anybody know some good strategies to use against that PA pass.

The main issue that I had was that in man coverage, you have two routes that are problematic. The intermediate drag by the slot WR can get open, and the HB coming out of the backfield is often wide open because his man is coming from the other side of the field. I had some success in zone, but getting pressure on the passer was problematic.

On jump balls, press A in stead of going for the pick

[Born Ona Mtn]

Nice job. He sure was in love with that PA pass from (I think) Ace Slot.

One thing I noticed on those videos is that it seems like it's a lot easier to throw on the run on NG. A lot of those passes you guys completed while scrambling/rolling out would've been incomplete or picked on CG.


LMAO, you gotta stop man, every freakin post and you beat the horse, you killed him he is dead leave him be....I am glad you like your CG game.


Way to work the X's and O's Lord Rhombic! :D

[rhombic21]

Fluff, he actually never used the stretch play, which made it very easy to play maker/pass commit. Only problem was that it didn't really seem to make a difference because the issue wasn't as much people biting on the fake, but that we couldn't get to the QB via pressure, so he had all day to pass. And then the alignment causes issues against man coverage, because the FS is often responsible for that HB, and he has to come from 15 yards back on the weakside to make the play, plus his vacating the area opens up the deep post because the SS has a difficult time roting over in time. I suppose one option would be to try and manually assign the SS to guard the HB, and see if that worked.

I might try something like what you suggested. I guess my only concern is that he'd see my coming out in Nickel and would start pounding away on the ground. But at least that would be a good place to start for long yardage situations where the run isn't a factor. I briefly tried coming with a cover 2 dime blitz where both slot CBs come off the edge, but abandoned it after I realized that it wasn't get pressure quick enough.

The other pass play that he uses from that formation is TE Option. He motioned one of the TEs over and has that guy block, which combined with the HB's delay route gives him a lot of time and the ability to scramble out to that side. Then that C route/Corner Route by the outside WR can be deadly against man, and the HBs delay route to the flat can be good against some zone or against a man D if the user controlling the Safety tries to help out on the corner route.

Really, this guy, like most "cheesers" isn't that good. If you play them enough times you can shut them down, because there's a counter for almost everything (except the glitch plays like double pass), and it's just a matter of figuring it out. Most of these guys only have 5 or 6 pass plays and 5 or 6 run plays, and usually they only have a handful of plays from each formation, so once you get a good fit on what they're going to do, it's pretty easy to shut them down. To me, this is what I love about this version of the game. Strategy and playcalling becomes much more of a factor than simply having good stick skills. I consider my stick on NG to be a little above average, but I can hang with high level players because I can usually out-strategy them.

[HcopenhagenH]

Rhombic....

Blitz from zone and hot route you DE's to contain. You'll get sacks. If you aren't use to hot routing the defensive ends to contain... Go into to play now and keep on doing it until you feel comfortable. I know I can hot route them to contain before they even take their stance at the LOS.

[Fluff E Bunny]

rhombic, I captured all of the defenses and here's a list of plays along the lines of what I was mentioning. Note, not limited to Nickel Normal.

Nickel Normal:
* Buck Slant 3
* 3 Man Under (since he isn't running the stretch, no big deal with DE drops)

Nickel 3-3-5:
* Overload Fire (but only if it lines the NB over the slot...if it brings the other CB over, skip it)
* 3 Man Under (same as above)

4-3 Over:
* Zone Blitz

3-4 Normal:
* Trio Whip Man, flipped (yes, it is man. Take the non blitzing OLB after the flip, back him off the line a little, and cover the RB flats area with him.
* Trio Sky Zone, flipped
* Weak Blitz

3-4 Under:
* Weak Blitz
* Trio Sky Zone, flipped

3-4 Even:
* Trio Sky Zone, flipped
* Weak Blitz


Yeah there are a few man defenses in there, but creative use of defensive player audibles can drop a guy into a zone he isn't expecting, such as the OLB on the twin TE side into a flats zone.

But basically, what you want to see if you can do is send three guys against the LT and LG and get one to come free...which should blow up the play action.


Out of curiosity, what happens when you bump and run against that PA play?

I really like the 3-4 this year because it actually works, unlike last year. It has a ton of different options too.

[M-Dub?]

LMAO, you gotta stop man, every freakin post and you beat the horse, you killed him he is dead leave him be....I am glad you like your CG game.


I wouldn't even say that I like the CG game. It's still frustrating as hell. I just like the $400 that I didn't waste upgrading this year. You can drown a lot of sorrow for $400... :D

[rhombic21]

Fluff, I tried to lab some of that stuff, but couldn't. Apparently the psychic CPU kicks in during practice as well, and the AI automatically audibles out of the play by canceling the PA. I think blitzing the play is a mistake. It's a max protect scheme so it's extremely hard to get pressure on the passer.

[rhombic21]

I played him 4 times tonight and went 0-4. This game is so stupid. NOTHING works against that PA pass. You can't blitz at all because nobody gets to the QB. And I can't even ****ing practice against it because the gay *** CPU audibles out of the PA against certain defenses EVERY TIME in practice. The only thing that semi-works is to go 4-3 Normal Buzz Weak and then try to manual with the FS, which is already hard as **** because the dude doesn't jump sometimes, and your depth perception is horrible. But tonight he realized that I was zoning up every time against that formation and started pounding me with dives up the middle ad nauseum. I guess pass commit is in the game, but half the time it doesn't seem to do anything and I end up hitsticking instead. And **** the triple option. So retarded.

The 3-3-5 is stupid. Nobody ****ing blocks the MLB more times than not and he comes in untouched. I went to 8 man protection schemes and the ****ing FB watched the LB run right around him (after he had already run right past the guard up the middle) and sack the QB in .25 seconds. I get impact WRs 1-1 with a Clemson's #2 CB on a stutter post, with no safety help at all, and John Parker Wilson throws it on the outside shoulder for a pick 6. Or I get a deep ball opportunity and the AI throws the ball too hard and it's batted down. Then there are about 96 other times that I pressed a button and watched the QB get sacked 2 seconds later.

And **** punt returns.

[blitzrique]

Next time you play the dude, why don't you run his offense and watch to see what he does to stop you [himself].

[Fluff E Bunny]

Fluff, I tried to lab some of that stuff, but couldn't. Apparently the psychic CPU kicks in during practice as well, and the AI automatically audibles out of the play by canceling the PA. I think blitzing the play is a mistake. It's a max protect scheme so it's extremely hard to get pressure on the passer.

Get a lab partner. If I had time this week I would love to help for this, but I won't be really free until Tuesday night.

[rhombic21]

It's stupid. The only way you can get pressure is to bring 8, and then you have to pray that he hasn't called a regular pass. You have to bring pressure up the middle and on the strongside because of the angle that the pocket forms (pocket is moved toward the strongside after playfake). If you try to blitz from the weakside, the guys just get picked up by the blockers, partly because they take retarded *** angles. Trying to manual on the deep ball is retardely difficult because the camera angle gives you zero depth perception past 30 yards.

I ran the play against him and he couldn't stop it either. He basically said that if you run that play 4 times in a row, it's almost impossible to stop every time.

The bigger issue though is the triple option. When combined with PA to the flats (with a HB @ FB) it's impossible to stop. Nothing that you call against the triple option that works is going to get any pressure on the passer consistently.

[cjones]

rhombic, don't you consider that in the least bit cheesy on his part?

[rhombic21]

rhombic, don't you consider that in the least bit cheesy on his part?
Yes, but that doesn't really matter. He doesn't care if it's cheesy or not.

[ac11367]

At least it's good to hear that the #1 player online is not doing it by dropping back the QB 20 yards and throw a perfect pass while backpedalling to a usually open WR running the corner route 30 yards from LOS. Compare to previous versions of EA's football game, what this guy did was saintly.

[TONY 4 MVP]

are you kidding me? how many times did you see him roll out and run the same PA pass play? I guess different people have different understanding of what is cheesy and what isn't. IMO, going to your money play and excessive amount of times per game is just lame.
I agree, but you have to admit , he doesnt play that bad for being the number 1 dude online. I expected a lot worse.

[HcopenhagenH]

I wouldn't even say that I like the CG game. It's still frustrating as hell. I just like the $400 that I didn't waste upgrading this year. You can drown a lot of sorrow for $400... :D


This is a silly statement. 360 version is heads and tails ahead of CG. You are eventually going to upgrade, so why not do it sooner rather than later?

[M-Dub?]

This is a silly statement. 360 version is heads and tails ahead of CG. You are eventually going to upgrade, so why not do it sooner rather than later?

A) Because it'll be cheaper next year.

and

B) Because, as Rhombic's videos show, there are still plenty of AI flaws on NG. It's hardly "heads and tails" ahead. The money plays are just different. What's "straight" on CG is "cheesy" on NG, and vice versa.

and

C) Because just on general principle, there's no way in hell I'd spend $400-500 to play a college football game where I'd be called "cheesy" for running an option-based offense.

[Avenge1]

What's up ChadSimons. How's ole' Helen Keller going to do this year at QB?

[rhombic21]

Another pair of games against him. Note that he did beat me 3 or 4 times in a row in between the last games that I posted and these.

http://stage6.divx.com/user/rhombic/video/1588248/Arkansas-Auburn
http://stage6.divx.com/user/rhombic/video/1588005/Iowa-Clemson-2

[BESTinSTL]

rhombic, I only played the college game a handful of times, but trying running nickel LB blitz, and shift the DL left and crowd the box.


On offense, motion your rb out, block him, and then motion him in, or run weak/strong I and reblock the FB so his block isn't going to the side, but straight. That will help pick up the blitz up the middle.

Hope this helps, I watched 2 vids you put up vs this guy, somebody said that guy can ball, but looks like you can ball too!

[ChadSimons]

What's up ChadSimons. How's ole' Helen Keller going to do this year at QB?

Still secretly obsessed with me I see....... Helen will be good. Look me up after K-State beats Auburn today.

[HcopenhagenH]

A) Because it'll be cheaper next year.

and

B) Because, as Rhombic's videos show, there are still plenty of AI flaws on NG. It's hardly "heads and tails" ahead. The money plays are just different. What's "straight" on CG is "cheesy" on NG, and vice versa.



I highly doubt it will get much cheaper.

Plenty of flaws on NG? I watched his videos and have no idea where you come up with plenty of flaws. This is a boneheaded statement. With exception to option there is basically a counter to everything you see in Rhombics videos. EA gives the you the tools to stop cheese play on NG. You will never get it on CG.

I have played CG and NG. The entire running game on CG is broken. The defensive AI is broken. etc. etc. etc.

[cjones]

What's up ChadSimons. How's ole' Helen Keller going to do this year at QB?

Someone once called Sam Keller 'Hellen'

once

only once

[ChadSimons]

Someone once called Sam Keller 'Hellen'

once

only once

You shouldn't hang me on a hook, Johnny. My father hung me on a hook once. Once!

5205


BTW Jones............ are you from NEB ?

[cjones]

BTW Jones............ are you from NEB ?

Omaha, yessir

[ChadSimons]

Omaha, yessir

South Sioux City here........ GBR